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Original: 5/2/2008 11:11 PM
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Friday, May 02, 2008

 why the pressure to tithe?
In many religions, there is a concept called, "tithing" where you are mandated of your own good graces to give a percentage of everything you earn to your group.  This has baffled me for years, and here is why:
I do very much understand the concept of abundance and using your good fortune and abundance to assist those in need.  When I donate, I give the same amount of due diligence in the charitable organization as I would in making an investing decision.  I look up their administrative load, their percent of dollars that go directly to aid, etc.  I am this way because I gave a generous donation to the Red Cross right after 9/11, and of course the big controversy erupted that made me feel like an idiot.  From that point on, I knew that my hard-earned dollars were going to go to hard-working charities.
Having said that, donating is a private act.  I firmly believe this.  It is very personal, and this is why so many large donations are given by "anonymous donors".  When/how/"IF" you donate is NOBODY'S BUSINESS.  I am not going to look at you weird if you do not donate to charities, you are going through your own thing right now.  I don't want to know what you do with your donations.  If you do give, I won't go, "good, you should".  If you don't, I won't think what the hell is wrong with you, you greedy bastard.  It's your decision.  I do not care what you do with your dick.  I do not care what you do with your vagina.  I do not care what you do with your stem cell.  You are learning/discovering/discerning on a path to greater poise, distinction and clarity.  So am I, and so is the person next to you.

It doesn't matter to me how you worship.  Do you pray to allah?  Dig it.  Are you hasidic jewish?  That's neat!  Follow Scientology?  Not for me, but if you are happy then so am I.  Are you a Mormon?  Nephi led the tribe! 

You are going through your own path of discovery.  So why do people in a group/organization/congregation pressure their pew neighbor to tithe?  That's MEAN.  That person may have a hard time feeding their family.  They may have difficulties that you know nothing about.  And yet, there is that pressure to "Look" as the basket goes around to "see" if you were "good" and gave.
Donations should be of personal conviction, and completely anonymous.  ABSOLUTELY.  I know so many people who really REALLY are in financial straights right now who wouldn't be if they had put their 10% into conservative investments over say a decade or two, and would've been quite wealthy but instead are having difficulties.  My opinion is that if donations were anonymous, then honestly - the rich people would more than make up for those who are struggling.  Rich people can write a single check that is more than some families make in a year.  
Then there is that pitch that whatever you give, you get ten times in return.  Look around you.  Look at your own experiences.  Is that true?  If not, can you formulate a reason?  Of course you can!  So can I (abundance is not measured in dollars, etc)

But I've seen some groups absolutely pound massive guilt and fear and even embarassment to fellow members to "give until it hurts".  Again, it is none of anybody's business what people do with their donations - and therein lies the paradox.  I believe that donations should be anonymous - and this would prevent people from getting in too deep with their tithing.  Yet having said that, whatever you want to do with your money is completely up to you.  If you want to have financial hardship from tithing past a common-sense point, that's your choice.
Consider this; when the person at the podium is pounding on and on about how you should give and give - consider that this person wants your money.  Is that not true?  Don't say, "no, he is asking for God" that's not my question.  My question is this - does the person at the podium want YOU to transfer your money to that person - as in - will that person provide a receptacle to receive funds from you directly?  Will this person receive the funds?  Does this person benefit in any way (lifestyle-wise) from you doing this?  Honest answers appreciated.
 Posted 5/2/2008 11:11 PM - 3176 Views - 44 eProps - 33 comments

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Visit tomsmarch's Xanga Site!
Well the add link did not work so here it is.

www.12stone.com/resources/messages.php
Posted 5/5/2008 10:05 AM by tomsmarch - recommend - reply

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Gary, I think you made a couple of key points.

There should never under any circumstances be a pressure to tithe. And you're right - giving to charity is personal. So is tithing, perhaps even more so as it is a solely spiritual act. I don't know if it's necessary to tithe to be a good Christian. It certainly doesn't gain any favor.

Our small church doesn't even mention in. We have a basket at the back, and if you went there for the first time and wanted to tithe, somebody would have to point it out to you. You just do it whenevr, or you don't. Now, I've worked at an extremely large 7000+ church. It ran like a business - not in a sordid way - but just because the money they dealt with was ridiculous, and charts wold breakdown our "Family Giving Units"..... I left pretty quick.
Posted 5/5/2008 2:10 PM by JarrettGreen - recommend - reply

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Gnetx, and how long ago was this?  We can agree to disagree.  I know the Holy Spirit used one of Billy's messages to rededicate my life to Christ in 1978.  I've been hearing him since 1975 all the way to when his son Franklin preached his first sermon which was here in Charleston, WV and NOT ONCE was giving mentioned.

Posted 5/5/2008 6:27 PM by lightinspiration - recommend - reply

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Interesting post. I myself attend a church where we are asked to pay ten percent of our increase. My personal belief is that God gives us all we have and it is out of obedience and gratitude that we give back. And as someone metioned earlier it's not that He needs the money, the tithing is more for our benefit. The tithing money given to my church doesn't go to pay the clergy, it helps build more meeting houses and provide welfare for those in need both in the donors immediate area as well as places effect by disaster such as Hurricane Katrina and the tsunami in Indonesia.
Posted 5/8/2008 11:22 AM by jalexise - recommend - reply

Visit Carlos_Hernandez's Xanga Site!
Gary,
In some ways you have the wrong understanding on tithing & in some others your right. It's not so much that God or even some ministers need the tithe but the condition of your heart behind your giving. Sure you have those that abuse tithing but their judgment awaits them. But the idea that you need to walk away with is that God owns all things & he owns your very breath. When we give we must give with a cheerful heart & that my friend is the bottom line. It does no good to give unto others when you give grudgingly.

Here are two books on Tithing:

The Lord's Portion
A book that uses the scripture to back up tithing.
http://misslink.org/chapel/askaminister/practical/tithing.html

The Tithing Dilemma
A book that touches on the "correct & incorrect methods" of tithing
http://askelm.com/tithing/index.asp
Posted 5/10/2008 7:04 AM by Carlos_Hernandez - recommend - reply

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When Gary believes in something, he has demonstrated numerous times that he has a heart to give. God has blessed him with that heart attitude.
But he doesn't believe in God the way Christians do, and scripture is clear: 2 Corinthians 4:3,4: "And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing. The god of this age (Satan) has blinded the minds of unbelievers, so that they cannot see the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God."
Posted 5/10/2008 8:08 AM by theojohns - recommend - reply

Visit Carlos_Hernandez's Xanga Site!
I'm not questioning Gary's giving, I have no doubt that when he gives that its being done with what seems to be the right motives; but who knows the heart's of men but God alone.

The bible teaches:
"There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the ends thereof are the ways of death." - Proverbs 14:12

Jesus Christ also taught:
"...For unto whomsoever much is giving, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more." - Luke 12:48

Tithing has always been a sticking point between those who attend church & those who run the buildings where people congregate. The problem is you have many so called Christian leaders who abuse the way the tithe is collected. The make it "law" when it shouldn't be law. On the flip side you also have those that are blind & gullible enough to follow after their own greedy lusts, they swallow hook, line & sinker the garbage that is being spewed from some pulpits when it comes to the tithe & all the supposed riches that will follow. The balance is found when all types of giving is done according to the correct teachings of scripture. Tithing is not a New Testament teaching, tithing is an Old Testament teaching that was required of the Levite Jews. Gentile Christians were never commanded to tithe but to give out of great full heart.

I'm not sure of Gary's reasoning behind this post; I mean he has always come off as someone who has a form of spirituality & would have all his readers believe his theory on how all of mankind is on a road to discovery & enlightenment based on their own life experiences. But always remember its just "Gary's Theory". Gary always claims to respect the beliefs of others but you’ll always find him questioning & knocking Christianity's teachings or those few Christians who dare share an idea that is contrary to his own.

There is no doubt that when it comes to Christianity those of us who know better, know exactly where Gary stands. Gary believes in keeping his beliefs to himself, he doesn't believe in sharing them with others here when asked, only when something about Christianity rubs him the wrong way will he then post & reveal what he really believes.

As Christians maybe we ought to start questioning the rationalization behind his own New Age beliefs.

The Apostle Paul was correct when he said:

For I bear them record that they have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge.

For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and going about to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted themselves unto the righteousness of God. – Romans 2:3

Gary you’re going about trying to establish your own righteousness man & your very wrong my friend! Your wishy washy Christian friends aren’t being straight with you either, its not all pie in sky bro.

There is a Spanish saying that says:

La mentira se hace con palabras y también con silencio.

Translated:

Lying is done with words and also with silence.

When Christians keep their silence they are not being honest with you, they are lying to you.
Posted 5/10/2008 6:23 PM by Carlos_Hernandez - recommend - reply

Visit Carlos_Hernandez's Xanga Site!
Jim Reed Photos - You might want to read up on that dusty bible yourself & really study up on it you wiper snapper, I'm afraid you're tithe's worth of input isn't worth spit!

The tithe was established for the Levite Jews...period! Christians are not required to tithe according to the Old Testament but rather are required to give freely according to the New Testament.

I agree with you, it’s pretty funny when someone picks & chooses what they want to believe; in your case you don't even know what you’re talking about. - Smile
Posted 5/10/2008 7:22 PM by Carlos_Hernandez - recommend - reply

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